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Comments and Results for 'Hitori 857'

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StateTypeTitleSizePlayedAvg timeRating (#users)YoursYour bestPublished
UnplayedHitoriHitori 8578x85316:12Easy (198)Join free / Log in
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8th Jan
[Free]
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Your puzzle statistics First solution time distribution Overall puzzle statistics
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Slowest 10% not shown
0:00
12:02

Solution time without 'show wrong'
Slowest 10% not shown
0:00
11:38

Unaided first solution time
Slowest 10% not shown
0:00
11:38
Completed by260 users
Best time without any aid1:32 by Silke
Best time with minor aid0:55 by kocos
Best time with show wrong
or multiple sessions
0:30 by ACW1
Average solve time with no or minor aid5:24
Average difficulty rating - all players1.9/10.0
Average difficulty rating - no aid1.3/10.0
Average difficulty rating - minor aid1.0/10.0
Average difficulty rating - major aid2.5/10.0
Average difficulty rating - show wrong or
multiple sessions
2.0/10.0
12 comments (Add new comment)
Posted 8th Jan 2020 at 17:17
Last edited by Penelope 8th Jan 2020 at 17:17
Penelope Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Hard Completion time: 23:51 Used 'check puzzle' when incorrect
Hard because I find all the " non- numerical" puzzles hard. I really struggle with them.
Posted 8th Jan 2020 at 22:39
jnconaty Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Easy Completion time: 4:27 Used 'show wrong moves'
Thanks for bringing Hitoris and Hanjes back!
Posted 9th Jan 2020 at 13:15
Last edited by gareth 9th Jan 2020 at 13:20
gareth Administrator Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Moderate Completion time: 1:00 Used 'auto remove' Used 'show invalid'
Since it's been a while since there were many hitori on the site, I've posted a video walk-through for this puzzle here: How to solve hitori.

I tried it out on my colleagues and they both thought it was too speedy to follow clearly, and said that I needed to go much more slowly after I'd explained the rules, but I'd be interested in any other feedback too in order to influence future videos of this type.

And would such videos be useful? What puzzles or puzzle types would you like to see covered?

Posted 9th Jan 2020 at 15:53
Last edited by Penelope 9th Jan 2020 at 15:54
Penelope Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Hard Completion time: 23:51 Used 'check puzzle' when incorrect
I agree with your colleagues. It was a bit too fast and I already know the rules! I had difficulty following the logic in the later moves. I'll watch it again and see if it becomes clearer, but slower would certainly help.
I would also like to see Nurikabe explained.
Posted 9th Jan 2020 at 16:52
JoergWausW Daily subscriber Completion time: 1:36
I think a video tutorial is a good idea, and I consider it more likely to be used than a written essay these days (though I think it's sad that reading is getting out of style because of all these video platforms...). Making it personal by showing your face and voice is a big plus.

I agree that this video is too fast for someone who doesn't know the rules. And I can just keep up with your talking speed, but it might be too fast for people who have even more problems with listening comprehension in a foreign language than I do.

Some suggestions, intented to be inspirational:
1) goal oriented: maybe a good idea for all the "black&white puzzles" (concerning icon colors, hitori, nurikabe, hajie, slitherlink): start with a finished puzzle and explain why it is a solution according to all the rules. Change the correct solution and explain why that change makes it wrong, what rule is not followed anymore (rule by rule).
For hitori that might include: two shaded squares not adjacent, only diagonal, one big area, all black square are somehow repeated numbers, all not repeated numbers have to be white (or else it wouldn't be a unique solution - and how so).
After that, start with the plain grid and explain what leads to this.
2) structure/techniques: There are several solving techniques. Do them one by one, maybe more examples for each technique in the same grid. Start with easy ones (the bottom row example that was explained first (white 2), I don't consider this one an easy one). And If you know what to avoid (see suggestion 1) you get a better idea why to use this technique.
3) strategies: How to do the solving process - what to look for first...

Could be split into more than one video, too.

I might come up with more suggestions if you consider them helpful.
(and no, I'm not an explain-video professional... just brainstorming)

Posted 9th Jan 2020 at 16:59
gareth Administrator Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Moderate Completion time: 1:00 Used 'auto remove' Used 'show invalid'
Incredibly helpful, both of you - and thank you JoergWausW for all of the ideas. I particularly like the idea of jumping to the solution right at the beginning, to help make the rules clearer. I should also obviously think about where to start - perhaps this hitori was also a poor choice since it has quite evolved logic to solve.
Posted 9th Jan 2020 at 17:56
JoergWausW Daily subscriber Completion time: 1:36
I don't think this one is a bad one to start.

My starting point is different:
look at those three 8s in the bottom row. Two of them next to each other. One of them has to be white. That's why the third one on the left has to be black.
If you start with this black 8 and only use the rules "white next to black", "no repeat", "don't cut off white areas", half of this puzzle falls into place using these rules a couple times.
Then the 3-gate at the top right and the critical 4 can be introduced. After that most of it falls into places until the 7-gate-breaker.

Sounds like a progression to me... (of course you can try to find easier puzzles that only need the easy rules and then do this one as an advanced)


Also, other rules can be explained in this one on the fly:
- squares between two equal numbers have to be white,
- not repeated numbers have to be white...
- ...leading to the second 3 from the bottom in the first column completely surrounded by only white squares (after the crucial 4 is set, see above). That makes this 3 black, because if it were white, then the puzzle would not have an unique solution, because it also could be black (you don't need this here, but this rule might be handy sometimes)

After that you could start the same puzzle with some other ideas first.

Posted 9th Jan 2020 at 22:26
Elisabeth Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Easy Best completion time: 6:45 Time on first attempt: 9:33
Very interesting, particularly seeing you, Gareth, first time for many years of subscribing!!!

I start these by making all squares white between 2 equal numbers, also as JoergWausW states, I was waiting for you to make the left-hand 8 on bottom row black! Then I then check to see if I can now make anything black as a result.

Yes it was too fast and I found the cursor too small and not easy to detect. I did find it difficult to follow although I know the rules, but that was partly because I approach these puzzles slightly differently.

I enjoy Hitori puzzles, on my list of favourites but feel rather out of practice, although,hopefully that will be resolved in the coming weeks:)

Posted 9th Jan 2020 at 23:32
Thoult Rated puzzle: Easy Completion time: 6:01
It may have some inductive leaps, rather than just basic patterns (ABA, AB - AB, AA - A etc), but it's a small enough size that it should be a reasonable intro for anyone who doesn't know the game yet. Start with clearing all the ABAs, get yourself to a bottleneck with the 3s on the right hand side and you have a nice new strategy to explore using the rule that there's a single unbroken chain of cleared cells.
Posted 10th Jan 2020 at 11:42
MargaretS Rated puzzle: Easy Completion time: 8:31 Used 'show wrong moves'
There hasnt been a free puzzle on the 10th january. But there were 2 on the 8th.
Posted 10th Jan 2020 at 15:16
gareth Administrator Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Moderate Completion time: 1:00 Used 'auto remove' Used 'show invalid'
Thanks everyone for the ideas. I'll try them out and then make a new version. :)

MargaretS, thanks for bringing this to my attention - clearly this is something I need to look at then. (There were 2 on the 8th only because I retrospectively made this Hitori free after I posted the walk-through above).

Posted 11th Jan 2020 at 09:06
Penelope Daily subscriber Rated puzzle: Hard Completion time: 23:51 Used 'check puzzle' when incorrect
After making all the obvious squares shaded or clear I always reach a stage where my only way forward is trial and error and this takes time. I'm sure I'm missing a more logical next step.
And, as Elisabeth says, it was good to actually see and hear you, Gareth, after all these years of subscribing and passing comments back and forth.
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Key

  • A yellow/light blue highlight in the time distribution charts highlights your time, where relevant.
  • Rating scores out of 10.0 show the average difficulty rating chosen by users, where 1.0 is "Easy" and 10.0 is "Hard".
  • If a puzzle is opened more than once, including by loading from a saved position, then this is potentially a significant aid so it is listed as being completed with 'multiple sessions' for the purpose of the best time/average rating displays above.
  • Minor aid is defined as no more than one use of 'Check solution' when incomplete and/or no more than one use of 'Check solution' when wrong; and/or using highlighting aids (show repeated digits, show broken inequalities and show valid/invalid placements [slitherlink] only). Major aid is any and all other use of the solving aids except for 'show wrong'.

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